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  #21  
Unread 07-15-2008, 11:01 PM
lemming's Avatar
lemming lemming is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Duvall, WA
Keep in mind, I have removed that Extender unit, which did some funky stuff with the factory rev limiters. It gets up to 110 pretty well, but past that is pretty much a joke. I know it's not a hard limiter, because I've managed to get it to slowly crawl up to 120, but it really does feel like it backs off the timing at that speed. The V6 car, which has all factory limiters removed, blows past 130 like nothing, but the 150 hp advantage and late-rising torque curve probably also has something to do with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BB
Are you thinking of having it as just a spare set or will this be so you can have a street set and a track set?
The latter. The current R4S pads are too much of a compromise. They don't have the cold stopping performance of a true street compound (like the Hawk HPS I use on my V6 car, which will pretty much knock your teeth out for three back-to-back 60mph stops, but run out of steam after that), but it's obvious that they're a bit compromised for hardcore use.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BB
Honestly, get a good set of R-compounds and be done with it.... assuming, of course, that "street compound" wasn't a vague reference to them. No point having tires that'll get too greasy
Maybe. I really was thinking of just going to a wider street tire and running a bit more camber on the front. I have no experience with driving on R-compounds, though--do they give as much warning when you're about to cross the limit as a street tire does? My main concern is what happens when I run out of talent.

What R tires have you used? What would you recommend?
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[2003 4.2L V6 Mustang] [1999 Subaru Impreza WTF]
On our way back from the beach, we were trying to decide where to eat dinner. At that moment, we were passed by a Rendezvous with the Ohio license plate "ASK GOD." So we did, and we ended up at some shitty Texas roadhouse-style place. Next time, I pick.--AchTTung
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  #22  
Unread 07-16-2008, 06:29 AM
BeerBurner's Avatar
BeerBurner BeerBurner is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Sterling, Virginia
I hear that R-compounds don't give you as much warning but since you have already had a couple track days, I'd imagine you know what to do if something breaks loose. And hell, I have never tracked the Porsche on anything but R-compounds and have only ever spun the car once, and that was because of a bad downshift upsetting the tail of the car. If you're going to buy another set of tires, you may as well get R-compounds, IMHO.

I have only ever tracked the Kumho Victoracers that I bought used for the 944 and have been happy with them, but clearly, I have nothing to compare them to. Kumhos seem to be well-liked for budget R-compounds.

The Miata has a used set of Falken Azenis which are really more of a street/R-compound hybrid. They can be driven daily like street tires but are good enough to be considered track tires as well (there's a 944 Cup racer who uses them). From what I hear, though, they can start getting a little greasy when hot, too, but that doesn't seem to stop people. Matt has a set for his 928 that he's going to use as rain tires for when he's finally racing the thing.

Toyo Proxis RA1's are highly regarded as well. People at Miata.net love them and they are the spec tire for the CMC (Camaro Mustang Challenge) cars that Colin races in. They're being discontinued for the R888(?) which I imagine will also work.

These aren't going to be the overall stickiest R-compounds out there, but what they give up in stick they make up in durability. I think this is good for people like us who aren't interested in those last couple tenths of a second and would like to get a few extra track days out of them. Plus, the Falkens and Toyos can be put on the car at home and driven to the track (I do that with the Kumhos, too) with less heat cycling risk, should you decide to do that.

BB.
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  #23  
Unread 07-16-2008, 07:47 AM
lemming's Avatar
lemming lemming is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2005
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That sounds good to me. By the time I'm done with the Slowbra, I'm not really going to like driving it on the street very much, so using a DOT R-compound that is just streetable enough to survive the drive to the track might be a good idea.

Quote:
The Miata has a used set of Falken Azenis which are really more of a street/R-compound hybrid.
RT-615s? Those seem to be reasonably popular among the autocross crowd, as well. I think Kumho is coming out with an Ecsta XS tire that looks like it is designed to compete with those.

Quote:
They're being discontinued for the R888(?) which I imagine will also work.
One of the guys at Monday's track day was using those on his Exige.

You're supposed to shave most R-compound tires, right? What kinds of places have the equipment to do that with?

edit: Hmm, Discount Tire (which has a store near me) apparently carries Nitto NT01s. I've heard good things about those as competition tires, too.
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[2003 4.2L V6 Mustang] [1999 Subaru Impreza WTF]
On our way back from the beach, we were trying to decide where to eat dinner. At that moment, we were passed by a Rendezvous with the Ohio license plate "ASK GOD." So we did, and we ended up at some shitty Texas roadhouse-style place. Next time, I pick.--AchTTung

Last edited by lemming : 07-16-2008 at 07:56 AM.
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  #24  
Unread 07-16-2008, 08:45 AM
BeerBurner's Avatar
BeerBurner BeerBurner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemming
RT-615s? Those seem to be reasonably popular among the autocross crowd, as well. I think Kumho is coming out with an Ecsta XS tire that looks like it is designed to compete with those.
I believe they're the 615s. They probably would make a good compromise fire-n-forget tire. But like I said, I've read reports of them not holding up to heat as well so I would probably only recommend them if you're looking for having only one set of tires for the car. That said, people run their Toyo RA1s as daily driver tires, too, and don't report any problems in doing so.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lemming
You're supposed to shave most R-compound tires, right?
Unless they're rain tires, it's recommended to shave them. This way, the tread blocks don't flex as much.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lemming
What kinds of places have the equipment to do that with?
Specialty repair shops might have the stuff, I don't know. Tire Rack will shave them for you for something like $15/tire.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lemming
Hmm, Discount Tire (which has a store near me) apparently carries Nitto NT01s. I've heard good things about those as competition tires, too.
Matt told me he's heard good things, too, and I was considering buying a set when I was looking for R-compounds for the Miata.

BB.
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'98 BMW 323is (her's)
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  #25  
Unread 07-16-2008, 09:06 AM
lemming's Avatar
lemming lemming is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2005
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I saw that TireRack offered heat-cycling services for $15/tire, which is probably worth it because I'm not the kind of person who'd "prime" a tire for its first track use by driving like a moron on the street. I didn't see anything about a tire shaving service, though.

I'm thinking that I should probably get a second set of wheels (whatever's cheap, not garish, and 17x9 with a 5x4.5" bolt circle) and a set of R comps. I could probably leave the Rs on the Cobra most of the time because the V6 car is much more enjoyable to drive on the street, effectively relegating the Cobra to occasional driver/track mule duty.
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[2003 4.2L V6 Mustang] [1999 Subaru Impreza WTF]
On our way back from the beach, we were trying to decide where to eat dinner. At that moment, we were passed by a Rendezvous with the Ohio license plate "ASK GOD." So we did, and we ended up at some shitty Texas roadhouse-style place. Next time, I pick.--AchTTung
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  #26  
Unread 07-16-2008, 10:16 AM
BeerBurner's Avatar
BeerBurner BeerBurner is offline
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Hmm... Maybe they don't offer it anymore?

BB.
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'98 BMW 323is (her's)
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  #27  
Unread 07-16-2008, 10:30 AM
lemming's Avatar
lemming lemming is offline
STOP EATING MY SESAME CAKE!
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Don't know. I suppose I could ask.
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[2003 4.2L V6 Mustang] [1999 Subaru Impreza WTF]
On our way back from the beach, we were trying to decide where to eat dinner. At that moment, we were passed by a Rendezvous with the Ohio license plate "ASK GOD." So we did, and we ended up at some shitty Texas roadhouse-style place. Next time, I pick.--AchTTung
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  #28  
Unread 07-16-2008, 09:43 PM
94whitesnake 94whitesnake is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemming View Post
Keep in mind, I have removed that Extender unit, which did some funky stuff with the factory rev limiters. It gets up to 110 pretty well, but past that is pretty much a joke. I know it's not a hard limiter, because I've managed to get it to slowly crawl up to 120, but it really does feel like it backs off the timing at that speed. The V6 car, which has all factory limiters removed, blows past 130 like nothing, but the 150 hp advantage and late-rising torque curve probably also has something to do with that.

Yeah stock computer has a soft speed limiter: it dumps tons of fuel after a certain speed. I think it's supposed to kick in around 95mph? Geoff didn't experience that because the extender removes that feature. (good job Geoff!)
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  #29  
Unread 07-16-2008, 10:34 PM
lemming's Avatar
lemming lemming is offline
STOP EATING MY SESAME CAKE!
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Duvall, WA
It sure seems like the fuel usage goes sky-high when I actually start trying to top it out on the track, so I guess that's possible, although Fr0d usually implements rev/speed limiters with a massive timing cut (which would also explain the total lack of acceleration at the top end). I suppose I could put the extender back on, but I'd swear it really did some bad things to part-throttle response. I wonder if a TwEECer would let me adjust the limiter behavior.
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[2003 4.2L V6 Mustang] [1999 Subaru Impreza WTF]
On our way back from the beach, we were trying to decide where to eat dinner. At that moment, we were passed by a Rendezvous with the Ohio license plate "ASK GOD." So we did, and we ended up at some shitty Texas roadhouse-style place. Next time, I pick.--AchTTung
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  #30  
Unread 07-17-2008, 05:48 PM
94whitesnake 94whitesnake is offline
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You're god damned right it would. Get the "real time" option and watch all the pretty sensors on a laptop while you drive.
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